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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256484 by dusty » Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:43 pm

farmerwd wrote:Thanks everyone!

I've got 2 kiddos under 4 & 1 on the way - dollars & time are at a premium so I'll persevere! :D

@JPG I have attempted to spray some penetrant next to the collar a few times, but I can't be certain it's not just rolling right off. I'll give it some more opportunity if I can wiggle it out at all.

@dusty Ha - understood! My only source of heat would be a kitchen torch anyway - pretty hesitant on trying because who KNOWS what flammable delights await me. Thanks for the info! And yes - I have been considering picking two of those up - I don't actually have any strap wrenches like that - new tool excuse?

@reible Good point - I tried to go drill press mode this morning with a hacky vial of pbblaster for it to just sit in... but it didnt quite work out, it wasn't high enough to soak the plate to lathe connection. Might try again tonight.

@WileyCoyote Babysteps! I'm not sure I've got the tools to handle a full quill extraction , but thats just a gut feeling.


Watch the video I linked. You don't need any tools to extract the quill from the headstock. Just make sure that you secure the quill lock as shown in that video otherwise you'll be dealing with the quill spring. You really don't want to go there. Just don't let the quill handle loose until you have locked it.

Heat maybe yes. Flame thrower no. Hair dryer or hot air gun.

---

"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256485 by everettdavis » Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:45 pm

Try this first. Use your penetrating oil if you have it or make some by combining equal parts (teaspoon or less) of Automatic Transmission Fluid and Acetone and mixing it in something not plastic.

With the set screw hole facing up, introduce that into the threaded hole til it takes no more. Jeep putting it in if it soaks in in 5 minutes or so til it stops.

Put the setscrew back in the hole and screw it in til it bottoms and tighten it. It will force mor liquid in.

Turn on the machine. Let it run and warm the metal up. The vibration coupled with the heat and the mixture will begin to break the rust bond.

Try it a few times repeating. You will have mix it fresh as the Acetone evaporates in that mixture.

It is the evaporation of the Acetone which diluted the viscosity of the mixture that allows it to flow in deeper. As it evaporates, it makes more room and breaks up the rust bond.

The normal fit is so tight most accessories make a pop when it is removed.

Everett

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256519 by farmerwd » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:35 am

Alrighty!

Status recap:

1. So I tried wrenching on it as gently as I could - no avail. I didn't expect as much, but it was worth a try. I'll look around for some of those strap wrenches this weekend.

2. I thought I'd found a perfect option to submerge the thing in penetrant... See orange liquid in the photo. Turns out the penetrant found a stress fracture in that and found it's way out lol. For future reference, dollar store salt shakers fit the quill spindle *almost* perfectly.

3. At this point I was trying to remind myself to be patient, so I worked on busting some rust off of the pipes, and left the lathe center submerged in pure ATF-4. I had some old bottles on hand, no acetone, so I figure it wouldn't hurt.

4. Watched the quill removal video and laughed because I just about did it when I took apart the handles to clean / oil the locks. Good to know that's an option available to me if all else fails.

Next steps: We will see how the bath did this evening, but I started thinking on the way to work today - what would happen if I set it all up to lathe some heavy scrap, say a 4x4 chunk, just without the set screw in place. Would the heat of the machine + the centripetal force of the wood spinning allow for the rust to experience some sort of torque safely? Or at least in a manner the system is designed for? Seems better than hammering at it or drilling into the lathe center at this point.

Food for thought.

Attachments

oils.jpg
Left - PB Blast - Right, ATF-4
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Brand new to Shopsmiths - Working with & working on a MarkV - SS54109.

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256520 by oldiron » Fri Feb 01, 2019 11:44 am

Welcome! One word of caution, these machines are addicting!!!😊

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256522 by dusty » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:12 pm

I would not want to watch that spinning lathe operation BUT.....well....maybe

When I first started reading I thought you were going to try to hold the wood and spin the lathe....please tell me that never entered your mind.

---

"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256524 by farmerwd » Fri Feb 01, 2019 12:54 pm

As the manuals say - have confidence in the machine, but a healthy fear of it as well. I aim to keep my fingers where they are dusty lol!

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Brand new to Shopsmiths - Working with & working on a MarkV - SS54109.

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256534 by tucsonguy » Fri Feb 01, 2019 5:37 pm

Try Kroil. It is better than any other penetrant I've ever used. It really works. Let that sit for 24 hours. Then heat. Then wedgie.

Also, if everything else fails, I would remove the shaft completely, remove the plastic coupler, then heat it hotter and try again.

It may be that its not rust, but physical burring is causing the jam, in which case even heat may not solve it, you may have no choice but to use a gear puller. I would suggest at that time you're going to have to sacrifice the drive spur, and use a power hacksaw or grinder to cut off the end and keep cutting till you expose the end of the quill shaft. At that point you can put a gear puller on it and simply crank it off. With any luck you will be able to clean up the burr with some light filing and be back to work...

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256537 by JPG » Fri Feb 01, 2019 6:17 pm

I doubt ATF without the acetone will work.

I am curious where one finds Kroil to purchase.

I am still a believer in kerosene.

Turning a 4x4 between centers sans set screw may be fruitful.

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╔═══╗
╟JPG ╢
╚═══╝

Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256538 by dusty » Fri Feb 01, 2019 6:43 pm

JPG wrote:I doubt ATF without the acetone will work.

I am curious where one finds Kroil to purchase.

I am still a believer in kerosene.

Turning a 4x4 between centers sans set screw may be fruitful.


http://www.kanolabs.com/penLub.html

---

"Making Sawdust Safely"
Dusty
Sent from my Dell XPS using Firefox.

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Re: The wisdom of the masses

#256541 by tucsonguy » Fri Feb 01, 2019 6:50 pm

Try Kroil. It is better than any other penetrant I've ever used. It really works. Let that sit for 24 hours. Then heat. Then wedgie.

Also, if everything else fails, I would remove the shaft completely, remove the plastic coupler, then heat it hotter and try again.

It may be that its not rust, but physical burring is causing the jam, in which case even heat may not solve it, you may have no choice but to use a gear puller. I would suggest at that time you're going to have to sacrifice the drive spur, and use a power hacksaw or grinder to cut off the end and keep cutting till you expose the end of the quill shaft. At that point you can put a gear puller on it and simply crank it off. With any luck you will be able to clean up the burr with some light filing and be back to work...

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