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sawsmith 2000 question

#48136 by lnrmiller » Sat Oct 03, 2009 3:45 pm

I've started having problems with the Sawsmith 2K I picked up about a month ago. After running for a while it doesn't want to start again. It will try to start and turn the motor backwards or just start slowly and trip the onboard breaker.

I first thought the capacitor was bad, replaced it and things were OK for a while. Now it's back to doing the same thing. Besides the motor the only other thing in the circuit is the relay, which is what I now suspect is the problem (certainly cheaper than the motor itself).

Anybody know anything about the relay? What I can replace it with?

This isn't stopping my wood working, my 520 is in great health.

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Rick
Jacksonville, FL
MKV 520 PowerPro, bandsaw, jointer, belt sander, SS2K

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#48144 by beeg » Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:31 pm

[color="Blue"]Have ya cleaned it out?[/color]

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SS 500(09/1980), DC3300, jointer, bandsaw, belt sander, Strip Sander, drum sanders,molder, dado, biscuit joiner, universal lathe tool rest, Oneway talon chuck, router bits & chucks and a De Walt 735 planer,a #5,#6, block planes. ALL in a 100 square foot shop.
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Bob

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#48145 by lnrmiller » Sat Oct 03, 2009 5:59 pm

You bet. First thing I did. Blew the sawdust out of the motor and every nook and cranny I could find. Waxed and polished everything possible.

Thought about the brake system as well. Thought it might be binding somehow, took it off completely and the saw does the same thing.

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Rick

Jacksonville, FL

MKV 520 PowerPro, bandsaw, jointer, belt sander, SS2K

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#48148 by recurvearcher » Sat Oct 03, 2009 7:42 pm

I'm not familiar with the motor for the SS2K.I recently purchased one so I will follow this post with great interest. I'm no expert, but the fact that it runs until hot then runs backward would lead me to believe there is an internal problem with the windings or centrifugal switch. I wish you luck with the repair. I hope someone can provide more information.

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#48153 by robinson46176 » Sat Oct 03, 2009 9:31 pm

I am not familiar with that motor but I would always check the centrifugal starting switch first. It is possible that it was not making good contact all of the time before and the action of working on the unit got it working again for a while. We used to joke a lot with vacuum cleaner customers who would have a cleaner that had stopped coming on. It was fairly common for folks to drag a non running vac in and we would plug it in and it would run. We learned very early on to always plug in any cleaner that "just quit starting" while the customer was watching... They were usually shocked and embarrassed when it would come on. We would joke with them about next time put in the car and take it for a ride... :) In those cases it was usually a bit of grit locking a carbon brush in its holder. With conventional motors it is very often the centrifugal start switch.
We just did a recent discussion somewhere here about how capacitor failure is fairly rare. The do fail but if the motor will hum then the centrifugal start switch is the the starting point of checking it out.

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--
farmer
Francis Robinson
I did not equip with Shopsmiths in spite of the setups but because of them.
1 1988 - Mark V 510 (bought new), 4 Poly vee 1 1/8th HP Mark V's, Mark VII, 1 Mark V Mini, 1 Frankensmith, 1 10-ER, 1 Mark V Push-me-Pull-me Drillpress, SS bandsaw, belt sander, jointer, jigsaw, shaper attach, mortising attach, TS-3650 Rigid tablesaw, RAS, 6" long bed jointer, Foley/Belsaw Planer/molder/ripsaw, 1" sander, oscillating spindle/belt sander, Scroll saw, Woodmizer sawmill

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#48168 by lnrmiller » Sun Oct 04, 2009 10:16 am

opened up the motor. I don't find a centrifugal switch. Wireing comes in and goes straight to the windings, nothing else in there. Took an ohm meter to it, no apparent shorts.

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Rick

Jacksonville, FL

MKV 520 PowerPro, bandsaw, jointer, belt sander, SS2K

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sawsmith 2000 question

#48173 by billmayo » Sun Oct 04, 2009 11:46 am

lnrmiller wrote:opened up the motor. I don't find a centrifugal switch. Wireing comes in and goes straight to the windings, nothing else in there. Took an ohm meter to it, no apparent shorts.


I would believe that any Shopsmith motor will have a centrifugal switch or a start relay for the start windings. If no switch, then there should be a small box with wires to it some where in the machine. Did you find a capacitor? A wire from the capacitor will go to the start relay/centrifugal switch and then to the start windings. How many wires to the switch and to the motor? You may have a bad switch that opens when hot. Do an ohm meter check of the switch when you encount the problem. I have found both switch and start relay (early greenies) problems on the Mark Vs.

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Bill Mayo [url]bill.mayo@verizon.net[/url]
Shopsmith owner since 73. Sell, repair and rebuild Shopsmith, Total Shop & Wood Master headstocks, SPTs, attachments, accessories and parts. US Navy 1955-1975 (FTCS/E-8)

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#48177 by JPG » Sun Oct 04, 2009 1:58 pm

With an external capacitor and start relay, I would expect the motor to NOT have any switch inside. As you have stated, wires going to the windings only(normal).

Also as you have already stated, the start relay IS the main culprit.

Sometimes they can be disassembled, but successful repair is NOT likely. It should have some identifying info on it. A pix would be helpful.

GE makes start relays - Somebody sells them(near you?). A motor 'seller' or electrical supply house may be able to help.

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╔═══╗
╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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had same problem

#48227 by houlerhoule » Mon Oct 05, 2009 5:19 am

Had the same problem a few months ago. I thought it might need a new starting capacitor. Removed the motor and brought to a local electrical shop that repairs and rewinds electric motors. He said he had worked on several other SS motors in the past and for the same complaint. He found that too much sawdust gets into the motor and it won't run. Needs to be blown out with air. My SS was manufactured in early 80's so I asked him to put new bearings, starting capacitor, and check the rest of motor out. He also found that the wiring bundles in stator were loose and needed to be re-tied. Cost me $35.00 for what I considered a complete overhaul.

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houlerhoule

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#48232 by lnrmiller » Mon Oct 05, 2009 10:21 am

I'll try to post a pic of the relay tonight. I ran all the numbers on it and came up empty handed, I've had real good luck simply googling the model number of a component and finding a replacement, just not this time.

As long as I have the motor removed I'll sneak out of work this afternoon or tomorrow and run it across town to the local elec motor shop and see what they have to say.

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Rick

Jacksonville, FL

MKV 520 PowerPro, bandsaw, jointer, belt sander, SS2K

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