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10er Dial Indicator.

#263103 by csxeng » Mon Sep 23, 2019 2:21 pm

When did Shopsmith start chroming the dial indicator on the 10er?

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263132 by everettdavis » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:59 am

It was introduced with the 10ER



Everett

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263152 by JPG » Tue Sep 24, 2019 11:32 pm

everettdavis wrote:It was introduced with the 10ER



Everett


Did late 10E have a dial indicator? Early ones only have a spring housing.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263157 by csxeng » Wed Sep 25, 2019 3:11 am

I’ve noticed that the early ShopSmith that I have (1949) doesn’t have a chrome dial indicater and spring cover, also it has a smaller notch, but the later model has a chrome dial indicator and spring cover, and has a wider notch to lock in the headstock bump.
Dave V.

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263158 by JPG » Wed Sep 25, 2019 9:10 am

I have previously thought that the calibrated quill depth dial was one of the improvements that the ER had that the E did not have.

Also IIUC the bump dimension varied.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263165 by everettdavis » Wed Sep 25, 2019 11:36 am

If you will review a PDF I created titled:
“SHOPSMITH Modifications 10E to 10ER made 1947-1953” you will find a good deal of information.

You will find it in a folder titled 10E & 10ER MAGNA under the link “My Google Drive”
at
viewtopic.php?p=185690#p185690

It should help with a good bit of the changes and differences through the years that I know of.

One complicating factor is that users, dealers and Shopsmith themselves performed upgrades on the 10E transforming it to 10ER.

Equally, during the 70 years since the 10E was made, users have disassembled, reassembled even mixed some parts as they maintained and serviced their machines.

In that directory you will find 3 manuals fully restored that are free.
1 The Preliminary manual
2 The 10E manual
3 The 10ER manual

Each of those you may find informative as you seek to define what you have.

Hopefully this will help answer your questions you have not yet considered.

Kindest Regards,

Everett L. Davis

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263167 by chapmanruss » Wed Sep 25, 2019 12:06 pm

The Depth Indicator or what you are calling the Dial Indicator with it's Spring Housing was one of the changes made around the time the Model 10 transitioned from the 10E to the 10ER. It came out with the 4th version of the headstock which also included the keyed Quill Lock. There were two versions of the Spring Housing that went with it. The first having the narrow opening for the headstock's cast on blocks that retains the Spring Housing in place. The second was for the wider cast on blocks on headstock version 5 and later. The plain Spring Housing was originally made out of Aluminum which didn't take Magna long to figure out that was a problem. They quickly changed it to steel. My 10E S/N 1077 has the Aluminum Spring Housing, which I still have but replaced it on the machine with a steel one for use. Everett's 10E S/N 1414 may have originally came with the Aluminum one or steel. 10E S/N 4708 and later 10E's I have had all came with the steel Spring Housing.

As Everett said
One complicating factor is that users, dealers and Shopsmith themselves performed upgrades on the 10E transforming it to 10ER.

Equally, during the 70 years since the 10E was made, users have disassembled, reassembled even mixed some parts as they maintained and serviced their machines.
A prime example of that is one of the original 250 10E's that has recently been for sale on ebay. It was upgraded at some point to the metal Extension Table. If I had the parts I could have just as easily changed the Quill Spring Housing to the later Depth Indicator one for S/N 1077.

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Russ

Mark V 520 S/N 09-11-01 completely upgraded to Mark 7, with all SPT's & more.
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ Shopsmith metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ Shopsmith metal ends & retractable casters.

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263206 by everettdavis » Fri Sep 27, 2019 10:08 am

Russ if we can refine more on when the casting change occurred in their early history I will add it to my resource file for updating a version 2 of the 10E to 10ER Changes document.

You wouldn’t by chance have saved a set of comparison photos of the two styles perhaps?

I could include them in that future revision if so

Everett

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Re: 10er Dial Indicator.

#263220 by chapmanruss » Fri Sep 27, 2019 1:19 pm

Everett,
When I began the restoration of S/N 1077 I also began taking pictures of the individual parts. I have individual part pictures for S/N 4708, R36013 & R55037 too. Yet to do is S/N 17731 and 69236 as I restore them. I also plan on dissembling S/N R64000 which is the first one I restored when I get time to touch up the paint and add the matte finish clear coat. Although I can show what it originally had when S/N 17731 is finished it will have a Metal Extension Table upgrade instead of wood. This is because of some damaged parts. The idea I had with these pictures is to eventually make a catalog showing each part and it's versions. Some parts have only one version like the Depth Indicator, Arm or Quill Return Spring whereas others have many versions like the Headstock with 7, the Quill with 3, the Spring Housing with 4 or the tailstock with 4. This is going to be a long term project and some pictures of part versions may be hard for me to get now. I have had only one 10ER S/N 76928 (sold) with hollow Table Rods but have not had one with the thinner Way Tubes. I do have pictures of the Shopsmiths I have previously restored that show which version of parts they have but few pictures of individual parts. At this point I can provide individual pictures of different versions of parts but to have groupings the parts may have to come off already restored or waiting to be restored machines.

As for when the casting for the Depth Indicator version of the Spring Housing changed from the narrow to the wide notches for the Headstock's cast on block to hold the Spring Housing in place that was the change from the 4th to the 5th Headstock versions. Serial Numbers in the range from around 25951 to around ER50177 have Headstock version 4. Serial Numbers in the range from around R49564 to around R51501 have Headstock version 5. To be closer I would have to have more information on machines than I currently do. Also the overlap is because the East And West plants were using their own sets of serial numbers with the letter prefix so R41009 was not made at the same time in the Western plant as ER41009 in the Eastern plant.

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Russ

Mark V 520 S/N 09-11-01 completely upgraded to Mark 7, with all SPT's & more.
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ Shopsmith metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ Shopsmith metal ends & retractable casters.

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