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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253200 by chapmanruss » Thu Oct 25, 2018 1:26 pm

While looking over the Mark 2 I noticed an interesting thing about what is the Headrest/Tie Bar which in the case of the Mark 2 is called Base and Tie. Something about it's design looks familiar.
Mark 2 Headrest Assembly - Base and Tie r.jpg
Mark 2 Headrest Assembly - Base and Tie r.jpg (369.67 KiB) Viewed 15842 times
Does the Mark 7 come to mind? It looks like if you change the Base and Arm to the Base and Tie, move the Headrest end in 3-1/2" like the base end and cut off 3-1/2" from the Way Tubes you would have a Double Tilt Mark 2.

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Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253214 by JPG » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:11 pm

chapmanruss wrote:While looking over the Mark 2 I noticed an interesting thing about what is the Headrest/Tie Bar which in the case of the Mark 2 is called Base and Tie. Something about it's design looks familiar.Mark 2 Headrest Assembly - Base and Tie r.jpgDoes the Mark 7 come to mind? It looks like if you change the Base and Arm to the Base and Tie, move the Headrest end in 3-1/2" like the base end and cut off 3-1/2" from the Way Tubes you would have a Double Tilt Mark 2.


Assuming your dimensions are correct, yes. And the lack of pinion gear and rack on the table mounting posts also makes a possible under table rout/shaping, but there is still the speed inadequacy.

I do not know if reversing the table places the table cutout(insert hole) correctly.

Yes another precursor of Mark 7 and 5xx stuff.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253244 by chapmanruss » Fri Oct 26, 2018 7:58 pm

I did not try reversing the table to see where the center of the insert ends up in relation to the spindle. That will have to wait for another day.

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Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253465 by amboyna » Thu Nov 01, 2018 12:32 pm

chapmanruss wrote:John asked
The one or two pictures of the Model 10 lower guard I have ever seen looked like cast iron as I remember. Is the MK 2 lower guard the same? Also, why do you say it will work with the Model 10 upper guard? The upper guard does no interfere with anything under the table. :confused:

The Model 10 Lower Guard I have is cast Aluminum I believe. Cast Iron would be heavier for the mass in the guard. Interesting the only reference I have for the Model 10 Lower Blade Guard is the November 19, 1951 Part Number conversion table. There are no pictures or part drawings on that table. I have not seen it listed in a catalog until the February 15, 1958 accessory catalog for the Mark 5 and Mark 2. It does not have a picture or drawing of it there either. Below is the Model 10 Lower Blade Guard I have which would be part number 162-1X or 12 370.
$matches[2]
$matches[2]
162-1X - 12 370 I c.jpg
I painted it but it was gray when I received it.

As for using the Model 10 Upper Saw Guard it works because there is a threaded hole just like the Model 10's have on the back edge of the table to attach the splitter to. Using the Lower Guard listed in the 1958 catalog, if it is the same Model 10 Lower Guard, requires an independently mounted upper guard. Again there in no picture or drawing of the upper guard in the catalog. The only guard shown is the set for the Mark 5 which is a 9" guard.

If anyone has a catalog or similar source picture of the Model 10 and/or the Mark 2 Lower Saw Guard it would be nice to see.


Wow. I just drooled on myself. The legendary lower saw guard for a 10E/ER.
I can only hope someday I might acquire one.

Attachments

162-1X - 12 370 R c.jpg
162-1X - 12 370 R c.jpg (341.17 KiB) Viewed 15704 times

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Shopsmith 10E S/N 5804 restored.
Shopsmith 10ER S/N R39267; purchased 10-10-50 in San Francisco.
Bruce Brenner
http://www.vintagepbks.com/shopsmith.html

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253472 by chapmanruss » Thu Nov 01, 2018 2:26 pm

For historical purposes it is nice to have the Model 10 lower blade guard but as a practical part to use, it scores pretty low, just above not having anything there. A better Lower Blade Guard that fits the Model 10's is the one for the Mark 5/V shown below and in my earlier post in this thread. Using the Upper and Lower Guards (505627 & 505628) together reduces alignment time if you keep them attached to each other. I would use the 5/8" Arbor with the machined washer next to the base, then the blade, the wide spacer and lastly the nut (see 2nd pic below). This moves the blade closer to the quill and keeps it from hitting the far side of the lower guard. Although, for safety, I use the later Arbor with the keyed washer instead of the original Model 10 version shown without it. You can use just the Lower Blade Guard 505628 with the Model 10 Upper Guard. Either way you add dust collection to your Model 10. even though the Mark 5/V Guard set was made for a 10" blade stay with the 8" blade since that is what the Model 10 Table was designed to use.
505627-505628r.jpg
Mark V Guard set on 10ER R64000
505627-505628r.jpg (129.23 KiB) Viewed 15704 times
505628-10ER.jpg
Lower Mark V Guard on 10ER R64000
505628-10ER.jpg (211.59 KiB) Viewed 15704 times

---

Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253475 by ChrisNeilan » Thu Nov 01, 2018 4:22 pm

chapmanruss wrote:For historical purposes it is nice to have the Model 10 lower blade guard but as a practical part to use, it scores pretty low, just above not having anything there. A better Lower Blade Guard that fits the Model 10's is the one for the Mark 5/V shown below and in my earlier post in this thread. Using the Upper and Lower Guards (505627 & 505628) together reduces alignment time if you keep them attached to each other. I would use the 5/8" Arbor with the machined washer next to the base, then the blade, the wide spacer and lastly the nut (see 2nd pic below). This moves the blade closer to the quill and keeps it from hitting the far side of the lower guard. Although, for safety, I use the later Arbor with the keyed washer instead of the original Model 10 version shown without it. You can use just the Lower Blade Guard 505628 with the Model 10 Upper Guard. Either way you add dust collection to your Model 10. even though the Mark 5/V Guard set was made for a 10" blade stay with the 8" blade since that is what the Model 10 Table was designed to use.$matches[2]505628-10ER.jpg


Thanks for posting this. I never would have thought to try that, and I have an old set of guards collecting dust - and not sawdust!

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Chris Neilan

Shopsmith Mark 7, Shopsmith Mark V 1982, shortened, Shopsmith 10 ER; Craftsman table saw (1964); Powermatic 3520B lathe

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253478 by jsburger » Thu Nov 01, 2018 5:36 pm

ChrisNeilan wrote:
chapmanruss wrote:For historical purposes it is nice to have the Model 10 lower blade guard but as a practical part to use, it scores pretty low, just above not having anything there. A better Lower Blade Guard that fits the Model 10's is the one for the Mark 5/V shown below and in my earlier post in this thread. Using the Upper and Lower Guards (505627 & 505628) together reduces alignment time if you keep them attached to each other. I would use the 5/8" Arbor with the machined washer next to the base, then the blade, the wide spacer and lastly the nut (see 2nd pic below). This moves the blade closer to the quill and keeps it from hitting the far side of the lower guard. Although, for safety, I use the later Arbor with the keyed washer instead of the original Model 10 version shown without it. You can use just the Lower Blade Guard 505628 with the Model 10 Upper Guard. Either way you add dust collection to your Model 10. even though the Mark 5/V Guard set was made for a 10" blade stay with the 8" blade since that is what the Model 10 Table was designed to use.$matches[2]505628-10ER.jpg


Thanks for posting this. I never would have thought to try that, and I have an old set of guards collecting dust - and not sawdust!


I agree with you Chris but, given that the same company transitioned from the 10ER to the MK 5 it is not really surprising.

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John & Mary Burger
Eagle's Lair Woodshop
Hooper, UT

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253486 by amboyna » Fri Nov 02, 2018 7:01 am

Nice setup Russ. But the OCD in me says I still want the original Lower Saw Guard. I know, get in line, right?

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Shopsmith 10E S/N 5804 restored.
Shopsmith 10ER S/N R39267; purchased 10-10-50 in San Francisco.
Bruce Brenner
http://www.vintagepbks.com/shopsmith.html

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253499 by chapmanruss » Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:25 pm

I understand, why do you think I have one.

---

Russ

Mark V completely upgraded to Mark 7
Mark V 520
All SPT's & 2 Power Stations
Model 10ER S/N R64000 first one I restored on bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters. Has Speed Changer, Model 4E Jointer, Jig Saw with lamp, a complete set of original accessories & much more.
Model 10E S/N 1077 oldest one I have restored. On bench w/ metal ends & retractable casters.

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Re: Just bought a Mark 2

#253554 by amboyna » Sat Nov 03, 2018 2:29 pm

From post 252880 you said:
The Model 10 Lower Guard I have is cast Aluminum I believe.

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Shopsmith 10E S/N 5804 restored.
Shopsmith 10ER S/N R39267; purchased 10-10-50 in San Francisco.
Bruce Brenner
http://www.vintagepbks.com/shopsmith.html

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