Shopsmith DEMO

[Ed in Tampa]

Happily, the exile for our customer was short lived since they found a way to meet the demand and they managed to maintain their quality and reputation in the process.

I hope NO ONE misses this point.

This is exactly what made the US great, we figured a way to reduce cost while maintaining or increasing reliability. Some where our thinking has changed we became complacent and instead of thinking up better ways of doing things we adopted the philosophy don't make waves if it is working let it alone. Naturally if nothing changes to reduce cost inflation will cause the prices to increase and we have accepted this as a fact of life. If Henry Ford had thought like this or if Edison thought like this I doubt we would have half of what we have today.

The US steel industry is an excellent example. The were huge and making a ton of money, they got fat dumb and happy. They stopped looking for ways to reduce cost or increase production. Why should they they were making a ton of money the way it was. In the mean time other countries were looking for the better ways. It is now cheaper to ship raw resources out this country to other countries have it turned into steel and shipped back as steel than it is to make it in this country. Don't think I'm right read the book, "And the Wolf Finally Came" by John Hoerr it details this happening in great detail. 680 pages of detail! And yes there were other factors but most if not all were rooted in why worry we are making a ton of money.

If you or anyone is selling product that is increasing in price each year because of inflation you will eventually go out of business, because someone is going to come along and will figure a better way. That is a fact of life.

It is a lesson our car industry is just now beginning to learn. Look at the differences in the cars in last 2 or 3 years especially Fords that figured this out quicker than the others.

[damagi]

I hope NO ONE misses this point.

This is exactly what made the US great, we figured a way to reduce cost while maintaining or increasing reliability. Some where our thinking has changed we became complacent and instead of thinking up better ways of doing things we adopted the philosophy don't make waves if it is working let it alone. Naturally if nothing changes to reduce cost inflation will cause the prices to increase and we have accepted this as a fact of life. If Henry Ford had thought like this or if Edison thought like this I doubt we would have half of what we have today.

The US steel industry is an excellent example. The were huge and making a ton of money, they got fat dumb and happy. They stopped looking for ways to reduce cost or increase production. Why should they they were making a ton of money the way it was. In the mean time other countries were looking for the better ways. It is now cheaper to ship raw resources out this country to other countries have it turned into steel and shipped back as steel than it is to make it in this country. Don't think I'm right read the book, "And the Wolf Finally Came" by John Hoerr it details this happening in great detail. 680 pages of detail! And yes there were other factors but most if not all were rooted in why worry we are making a ton of money.

If you or anyone is selling product that is increasing in price each year because of inflation you will eventually go out of business, because someone is going to come along and will figure a better way. That is a fact of life.

It is a lesson our car industry is just now beginning to learn. Look at the differences in the cars in last 2 or 3 years especially Fords that figured this out quicker than the others.

You hit the nail on the head - price is only one metric, but its an important one. If you cant even be in the ballpark on price then you are really in a bad position. As noted in previous posts, unless you are in a space crunch then the shopsmith pricing model really doesn't make a lot of sense...especially since the people that are price concious and/or space concious are going to be willing to make sacrifices.

[terrydowning]

I wonder if any Shopsmith execs are reading this thread?
I simply can not justify the cost of a power pro or a Mark 7 to myself much less my finance manager (SWMBO). If I can't justify it and choose to buy a competing product or no product at all and stick with what I have (which is the route I am currently taking) the end result is the same. Shopsmith lost the sale.

Ultimately my 1955 shopsmith is going to need some major repairs (Motor, Beraings, Quill, etc. it is almost 60 years old) When this happens I will be forced into deciding if I go with different products or come up with the money for the smith. When my cost to repair is almost the cost of a new lathe or a new table saw, one has to start evaluating all possibilities.

Motor $350
Replacement Quill (Includes Parts for a PolyV conversion since I have a gilmer and replacement quills are not available new from SS) $300
$650 and I still have a 1955 SS Mark 5

Replacement smith (Well, we've all seen the cost there)

In the end it will be my money and my decision which route to take. I just wish Shopsmith could make the choice easier.

[dusty]

You hit the nail on the head - price is only one metric, but its an important one. If you cant even be in the ballpark on price then you are really in a bad position. As noted in previous posts, unless you are in a space crunch then the shopsmith pricing model really doesn't make a lot of sense...especially since the people that are price concious and/or space concious are going to be willing to make sacrifices.

If price is not the MAJOR metric, please tell me why Chinese made products are doing so well. It certainly is not that they are much better quality and there is nothing new and unusual about these products.

Price is by all means the MAJOR metric.

If you care to break this down further, I will put my money on LABOR COSTS being the factor that allows lower prices for imported product.

There are a couple manufacturers who don't seem to fit in my concept however. Festool would be a prime example of contradiction. High priced and not Asian.

[dusty]

Ultimately my 1955 shopsmith is going to need some major repairs (Motor, Beraings, Quill, etc. it is almost 60 years old) When this happens I will be forced into deciding if I go with different products or come up with the money for the smith. When my cost to repair is almost the cost of a new lathe or a new table saw, one has to start evaluating all possibilities.

Motor $350
Replacement Quill (Includes Parts for a PolyV conversion since I have a gilmer and replacement quills are not available new from SS) $300
$650 and I still have a 1955 SS Mark 5

If your Mark 5 is operational right now, don't let it get to the point where you need to buy a new motor. Big savings possible here.

If you feel like you need a two bearing quill and Poly-V, do you need to buy it new? More savings available here.

The savings just might be enough to do a complete table upgrade.

[JPG]

I wonder if any Shopsmith execs are reading this thread?
I simply can not justify the cost of a power pro or a Mark 7 to myself much less my finance manager (SWMBO). If I can't justify it and choose to buy a competing product or no product at all and stick with what I have (which is the route I am currently taking) the end result is the same. Shopsmith lost the sale.

Ultimately my 1955 shopsmith is going to need some major repairs (Motor, Beraings, Quill, etc. it is almost 60 years old) When this happens I will be forced into deciding if I go with different products or come up with the money for the smith. When my cost to repair is almost the cost of a new lathe or a new table saw, one has to start evaluating all possibilities.

Motor $350
Replacement Quill (Includes Parts for a PolyV conversion since I have a gilmer and replacement quills are not available new from SS) $300
$650 and I still have a 1955 SS Mark 5

Replacement smith (Well, we've all seen the cost there)

In the end it will be my money and my decision which route to take. I just wish Shopsmith could make the choice easier.

All the bearings can be replaced for less than $50(much less
).

With frequent blowing out the motor(sawdust) it should not ever need replacing.(unless IFF the start switch sticks open and you 'let er cook'.

Proper lubrication will prevent break down due to lack of it.

Waxing will preserve the other parts.


Bottom line - proper maintenance will preclude the horror story you are concerned about.



Now upgrading is another animal!:eek:

[terrydowning]

I'm well aware of the advantages of preventative maintenance. But let's face it these things have moving parts and they do age. There is a limit.

I'm using my personal observations as an example that yes indeed price is important. The numbers provided are for a minimal "Upgrade" To go to a 520 Pro it's another $1200 in addition to that. To get to Power Pro 1400 to 1800 depending on the road I take. Plus the 520 upgrade. I may as well but a new Mark 7 (Which I am sure is what Shopsmith would prefer). I can do a lot with 4-5 grand.

Price is determined by what the market is willing to bear. If a company can't price their products competitively and still make a profit, then the product is doomed. It's just the economics of the issue. IMHO SS products are currently too expensive.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Mark 5 and I plan on keeping it alive for as long as I reasonably can including changing bearings and all of the other maintenance issues. My Smith was purchased by my grandfather in 1955 and I am the third generation owner. I plan on handing it down to one of my kids when the time is right.

If I had 5K rolling around with nothing to do, then I would go ahead buy a Mark 7. But until that day comes, I will make do as best I can. If that means purchasing a lower priced tool from another company, then so be it. How many of us have ONLY Shopsmith tools and do all of our tool shopping entirely at Shopsmith? I'd venture to say 0. We purchase other things from other companies because they offer a product that better suits our needs or they have the same product at a better price. Personally, I can't afford shopsmith's current prices.

[JPG]

I understand completely!
I have fairly recently acquired several SPTs that are 'new to me', but I could not have afforded SS new prices either.

My main object was to eliminate the $350 'motor scenario'.



P.S. My current SWMBO project is to convince her that spending $75 on a operating ss mount Scroll Saw is a 'good' thing!

[mrhart]

SS traveling Demo show comin to the Lowes in Boise at the end of May. They were just here in Feb as well.
Wish I was loaded................

[ryanbp01]

SS traveling Demo show comin to the Lowes in Boise at the end of May. They were just here in Feb as well.
Wish I was loaded................

Sure do wish an appearance would be made in Indiana (maybe the State Fair?)! Barring that, how about the possibility of setting up another "Owner's Weekend" in Dayton"? I really regret missing the last one! It would be nice to know if admin. would be able to pass that along; maybe Mr. Folkerth would be able to address some of the issues that have been mentioned here.

BPR