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Re: 1st SS! Neused MkV Video - Bearings, belt, lube, all 3?

#253598 by faultedgeologist » Sun Nov 04, 2018 1:42 pm

Below is
1 - Headstock with textured gray powder/paint.
2 - Alignment of shaft in cover plate is clearly off and adjusted to the max.
3 - belt in 4th groove
4 - adjusting offset. adjusting back a groove and re-tensioning.

Edit: The offset is difficult to rotate. Is there a recommended lube for this? I have to use a small screwdriver in there and a hammer to tap it around the circle. Tensioning will be difficult. Seems there should be a better way to tension a belt like a lever and lock.

EDIT 2: Broken bolt/screw above the offset tensioner. What is that for? Extraction looks fun.

Wondering if the belt wore in to this angle.

Attachments

shopsmith-mkv-1.JPG
headstock
shopsmith-mkv-1.JPG (472.29 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-2.JPG
plate alignment
shopsmith-mkv-2.JPG (535.11 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-3.JPG
vbelt
shopsmith-mkv-3.JPG (411.89 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-4.JPG
offset tensioner
shopsmith-mkv-4.JPG (384.43 KiB) Viewed 373 times
Last edited by faultedgeologist on Sun Nov 04, 2018 2:29 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: 1st SS! Neused MkV Video - Bearings, belt, lube, all 3?

#253599 by faultedgeologist » Sun Nov 04, 2018 1:47 pm

Below is
5 - Lower sheaves
6 - tablesaw double trunions
7 - bunghole
8 - drill chuck

Attachments

shopsmith-mkv-5.JPG
lower sheaves
shopsmith-mkv-5.JPG (367.39 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-6.JPG
tablesaw
shopsmith-mkv-6.JPG (387.7 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-7.JPG
backside service port
shopsmith-mkv-7.JPG (440.11 KiB) Viewed 373 times
shopsmith-mkv-8.JPG
drill chuck
shopsmith-mkv-8.JPG (347.32 KiB) Viewed 373 times

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#10 MACHINE oil.

Mineral oil maybe.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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The 'need' is to have the pulleys rotating when adjusting the speed control. It does not need to be under power. Using the sanding disk on the quill shaft to manually rotate the pulleys is adequate so long as the pulleys keep up with the speed control changes.

The poly-v belt appears to be in the third groove.(only two are showing) We counting grooves, not ribs.

When the eccentric is adjusted, the idler shaft moves. That is why the vent plate is mounted with sloppy holes.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: 1st SS! Neused MkV Video - Bearings, belt, lube, all 3?

#253611 by faultedgeologist » Sun Nov 04, 2018 3:48 pm

JPG wrote:The 'need' is to have the pulleys rotating when adjusting the speed control. It does not need to be under power. Using the sanding disk on the quill shaft to manually rotate the pulleys is adequate so long as the pulleys keep up with the speed control changes.


Sweet. Does it make the tension adjustment easier if in slow or fast speed at the dial?

JPG wrote:The poly-v belt appears to be in the third groove.(only two are showing) We counting grooves, not ribs.


I would say 4th groove, hard to see in the pic from the shadow. I moved it stockside one groove and now there are two grooves on each side of the belt.

JPG wrote:When the eccentric is adjusted, the idler shaft moves. That is why the vent plate is mounted with sloppy holes.


Heh, why didn't I think of that?!? :eek: :confused: :rolleyes:

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The adjusting eccentric bushing is sliding out as I turn, which is why I asked about what speed it should be at. It looks like PO beat the thing with a flathead screwdriver or something. I'd like to replace it at some point. For now I guess it is re-tension, run to high speed, oil the sheaves, cycle speeds, recheck.

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OK Guess what the purpose of the broken off screw above the eccentric was.

A big headed(washer head?) screw prevents the eccentric from moving out. Replacement is a must!!!!!

I dare say that was causing the poly-v skew.

The OEM screw may be self threading and therefore 'hard'. Extract with care!!!!!

P.S. Fast / Slow / wherever should not affect tension nor the effort to adjust it. However moving the idler shaft may cause the motor belt to resist movement when rotated.

I always increase poly-v tension by rotating the eccentric CW(from slot at 06:00). This moves the idler shaft towards the motor shaft and running torque will tend to move the eccentric towards a tighter poly-v belt. I would move yours from slot @ 02:00 to 10:00.

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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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Re: 1st SS! Neused MkV Video - Bearings, belt, lube, all 3?

#253626 by faultedgeologist » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:49 pm

JPG wrote:OK Guess what the purpose of the broken off screw above the eccentric was. A big headed(washer head?) screw prevents the eccentric from moving out. Replacement is a must!!!!! I dare say that was causing the poly-v skew. The OEM screw may be self threading and therefore 'hard'. Extract with care!!!!!


I can't wait! :(

JPG wrote:I always increase poly-v tension by rotating the eccentric CW(from slot at 06:00). This moves the idler shaft towards the motor shaft and running torque will tend to move the eccentric towards a tighter poly-v belt. I would move yours from slot @ 02:00 to 10:00.


That makes sense. Any easy way to press that whole tensioning assembly back in? I pressed with a board, but it looks like the speed dial arm inside is counter-pushing it out.

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Re: 1st SS! Neused MkV Video - Bearings, belt, lube, all 3?

#253629 by faultedgeologist » Sun Nov 04, 2018 4:59 pm

Pics:

10 - eccentric after cleanup, re-tension, attempted push back in. Haven't gone back to put at 10pm instead of 2pm yet. Is there a way to tell from the bearing model if I have a double bearing quill? I see Japan on the shielding. Evidence points many directions still. Is this 1981 or 85ish +?

11 - skipped, but the v-belt deteriorated pretty bad from speeding up the machine to full speed, dusting the bars black. I think it exceeded the max speed around U or V, and lost speed at X, Y, Z, Max. New belt should solve that. A guy who sells and repairs recommends a slightly wider belt. Opinions?

12 - belt is slack when turned off at U-speed. So now I should manually move the sheaves and get oil down to the shaft they ride on from my understanding. I'm using mineral oil today. Anyone with a gallon of the 10wt machine oil should sell little bottles.

13 - view of speed adjuster assembly. Should I disconnect it to get the eccentric back in and lined up?

14 - belt in what looks like the correct grooves now.

Attachments

shopsmith-mkv-10.JPG
Newly tensioned and cleaned up eccentric
shopsmith-mkv-10.JPG (349 KiB) Viewed 345 times
shopsmith-mkv-12.JPG
slack belt at high speed stop
shopsmith-mkv-12.JPG (324.37 KiB) Viewed 345 times
shopsmith-mkv-13.JPG
inside headstock
shopsmith-mkv-13.JPG (242.97 KiB) Viewed 345 times
shopsmith-mkv-14.JPG
belt in right position
shopsmith-mkv-14.JPG (303.8 KiB) Viewed 345 times

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faultedgeologist wrote:Pics:

10 - eccentric after cleanup, re-tension, attempted push back in. Haven't gone back to put at 10pm instead of 2pm yet. Is there a way to tell from the bearing model if I have a double bearing quill? I see Japan on the shielding. Evidence points many directions still. Is this 1981 or 85ish +?

11 - skipped, but the v-belt deteriorated pretty bad from speeding up the machine to full speed, dusting the bars black. I think it exceeded the max speed around U or V, and lost speed at X, Y, Z, Max. New belt should solve that. A guy who sells and repairs recommends a slightly wider belt. Opinions?

12 - belt is slack when turned off at U-speed. So now I should manually move the sheaves and get oil down to the shaft they ride on from my understanding. I'm using mineral oil today. Anyone with a gallon of the 10wt machine oil should sell little bottles.

13 - view of speed adjuster assembly. Should I disconnect it to get the eccentric back in and lined up?

14 - belt in what looks like the correct grooves now.


I doubt mineral oil will hold up long term. It is not made for the application you are using it for. Turbine oil sold in the big box stores is perfect. It comes in a small bottle with a zoom spout that is perfect for getting into the SS head stock.

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John & Mary Burger
Eagle's Lair Woodshop
Hooper, UT

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You are missing a couple of parts on the bearing end of the control sheave. It is possible(likely?) they are in the bottom of the motor pan. :( A wire loop and a tension pin.

I agree with John re mineral oil holding up. Ok til mamma gets back. :D

zoom spout is the bee's knees.

IIWM, I would perform a complete tear down and clean up etc.

A worn(narrow) motor belt will result in too high speeds.

I recommend the OEM belt. Jacob recommends the 15x625 but it is also slightly longer. The correct belt size is critical. From your pix I suspect the motor belt you have is too long and maybe too narrow.

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╟JPG ╢
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Goldie(Bought New SN 377425)/4" jointer/6" beltsander/12" planer/stripsander/bandsaw/powerstation /Scroll saw/Jig saw /Craftsman 10" ras/Craftsman 6" thicknessplaner/ Dayton10"tablesaw(restoredfromneighborstrashpile)/ Mark VII restoration in 'progress'/ 10E(SN E3779) restoration in progress, a 510 on the back burner and a growing pile of items to be eventually returned to useful life. - aka Red Grange

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